Baktari MD
Jonathan Baktari MD is the CEO of eNational Testing, e7 Health, & US Drug Test Centers. Jonathan Baktari MD brings over 20 years of clinical, administrative, and entrepreneurial experience. He has been a triple board-certified physician specializing in internal medicine, pulmonary, and critical care medicine.
Jonathan Baktari is a preeminent, national business thought leader interviewed in The Washington Post, USA Today, Forbes, Barron’s, and many other national publications. He is also an opinion writer for The Hill and the Toronto Star.
He is the host of a highly-rated podcast Baktari MD as well as a guest on over 70 podcasts. Jonathan Baktari MD was formerly the Medical Director of The Valley Health Systems, Anthem Blue Cross Blue Shield and Culinary Health Fund. He also served as clinical faculty for several medical schools, including the University of Nevada and Touro University.
Baktari MD
9 BEST Hacks to Bring You Success in 2024!
Welcome to episode 36 of Season 2 of Baktari MD! While we do have our own podcast, Dr. Baktari is also featured on many others as a guest! Here we have some of the BEST bits for taking your business to the next level in 2024! Check out the full episode for all of the tips and trick you need are right here! Find out all of this and more in the full episode!
00:00:18:16 - 00:00:30:04
Unknown
So I'm just curious to know what would you say are some of the primary benefits? Because, you know, a lot of people who are listening, either they're in leadership positions currently or they're thinking about it.
00:00:30:04 - 00:00:55:07
Unknown
You know, they're looking to potentially enter this space. And in my book, Becoming the New Boss. One of the things I talk about is that transition, some of the some of the positives as well as some of the potential pitfalls would love to get your take on that. Yeah. I mean, you certainly, I think, have to acquire new skill sets to move into like traditional just like being a doctor or a professor or whatever.
00:00:55:09 - 00:01:15:14
Unknown
I think understanding that you need to acquire new skill sets is daunting, and I feel like I've got to stay a doctor. How am I going to learn all this? But I think what you need to realize is you have to take baby steps. Just get on a committee, you know, just get involved in something. And what you will find is one door opens another door, if that makes sense.
00:01:15:14 - 00:01:34:11
Unknown
So I think, you know, like if someone in clinical medicine and say, well, I want to start my own company, where would you even begin? So you have to understand it cannot be like a light switch going off and on where okay, I'm doing clinical medicine now. I'm CEO of a healthcare company. There is, you know, 30, 40, 50, 100 little steps in between.
00:01:34:13 - 00:01:59:23
Unknown
And if you realize that opening one door often opens another door later on and if you and you don't know what that door will be. So it's almost like a leap of faith where you just have to jump in the deep end and get involved. And I think that's daunting because they're like, well, how how could just signing up for one little committee, you know, in a hospital, you know, get me to become my own CEO?
00:01:59:24 - 00:02:22:20
Unknown
It doesn't. But you do that and you also get on this committee and somebody sees you and they tell you about another committee and then, you know, they see that they're like, well, you know, you might be a good person for this. And and it's this idea of accepting that there be there will be other opportunities, but you've got to take baby steps and then eventually you get a bigger opportunity.
00:02:22:20 - 00:02:36:15
Unknown
I'm interested in knowing what you see. You know, for me, I work with a lot of doctors that have broken out of corporate and I have doctors that have been in telehealth years and years and years prior to the pandemic. So there was no real pivoting.
00:02:36:17 - 00:03:04:22
Unknown
You know, you really have to have almost this entrepreneurial mindset to not plan for the now, but plan for the future. And one of the things that I've seen you do really well is to, you know, jump on this podcasting social media. And I've heard I've heard all of the feedback, as you can imagine. I'm sure you have to I'm you know, I'm a professional darling.
00:03:04:24 - 00:03:27:02
Unknown
I don't need to do social media. Right. How do I do a podcast? Who wants to listen to me talk about, you know, primary care or plastic surgery or whatever? So what? What gave you that? What was it? What was it? What? Some people you know, I opened my media company three years ago because I listen to Gary Vaynerchuk and that's the truth, right?
00:03:27:02 - 00:03:47:17
Unknown
Like I thought I can do social media a heck of a lot better than what I see out there. Why would I go ahead and do that myself and add that to my business? So what was it for you? Well, you know, I'm like, I told you offline, you know, we're not doing this podcast, we're not selling anything, we're not trying to monetize it.
00:03:47:17 - 00:04:15:03
Unknown
I think I've always been an educator before. I, you know, I sort of got that part of me out by being on clinical faculty at medical schools. I've been on clinical faculty through medical school, so I've taught interns, residents, fellows, medical students, nursing staff, respiratory therapists. I mean, I've been in charge of education for them, you know, for most of my career on clinical staff in medical schools.
00:04:15:03 - 00:04:53:16
Unknown
And then within our organization, I'm, you know, very involved in education and making sure that we have quality and the staff feels comfortable doing everything. But I think, you know, this opportunity to do education and help people and promote preventative health and wellness, promote vaccine adult vaccinations was something that we felt really strongly about. And, you know, we're probably even though we're local in Nevada, you know, I really think when it comes to adult vaccinations, we are the 900 pound gorilla.
00:04:53:16 - 00:05:20:02
Unknown
I mean, there's nobody that knows more about adult vaccinations than my staff. I mean, they they are the powerhouse. I mean, truthfully, people, you know, in government sometimes reach out to us and ask for clarifications on things. We you know, we really because this is and mind you of course, I have an amazing staff, but something powerful happens when that's the only thing you do.
00:05:20:07 - 00:05:39:16
Unknown
Yes, I agree. You know, when you're when you're doing well, if you're in urgent care and you're doing a couple of vaccinations on the side, you know, in the corner, you know, a few times a week, you're not a vaccine authority. That's right. But when you don't do primary care, you don't do urgent care, you don't do occupational medicine.
00:05:39:18 - 00:06:08:05
Unknown
And all you do is focus on vaccinations and you set up policies, procedures, technology and training only to do adult vaccinations. You get a perspective that you can't get any other way. And so I think that that puts us in a very unique position. You know, I doubt there's anybody in the country that knows more about adult vaccinations than some of my clinical staff for sure.
00:06:08:05 - 00:06:27:13
Unknown
I mean, they they could they could be a world authority because they're doing a, you know, you know, all day long, you know, every day of the week. And so it's a pretty kind of interesting place because we live and breathe preventative health and adult vaccinations. So that puts us in a very unique perspective.
00:06:27:13 - 00:06:51:19
Unknown
There's definitely an opportunity for burnout on that end. But then also on the clinical end, right? I mean, as a physician, I'm sure you've had colleagues who, you know or even yourself have have kind of expressed concerns about burnout and thinking about like what the the industry looked like, you know, maybe 40 years ago compared to what it looks like today.
00:06:51:21 - 00:07:25:06
Unknown
What are your thoughts about that evolution? Well, well, you know, I think because you're in the business of, you know, revenue cycle and reimbursement. So let's start with that. I mean, just just the big elephant in the room, which is, you know, I think when you go and look at this from a satellite perspective, right. You know what, doctors and hospitals and people were getting reimbursed for services in 1970 versus 1980 versus 1990 versus 2000’s and 2010’s.
00:07:25:06 - 00:07:50:16
Unknown
And now I mean, if you plotted all that, what somebody gets reimbursed for an office visit for a colonoscopy, for an appendectomy, I mean, that graph is only going in one direction, okay? It's like if you plot it over time, it's going down. Even when adjusted for inflation. So so so you're by definition, going to make less money for that same thing.
00:07:50:16 - 00:08:18:22
Unknown
Four years from now than you were to by definition. I mean, could you luck out and maybe that one procedure doesn't get hit yet, but it's just a matter of time. So you're going to make less money. Okay. And here's the thing. Your costs are going up. So think about this analogy. Let's say in 1970, I tried to sell you a restaurant and I say, I want to sell you this restaurant, and here's what you can charge for your entrees and blah blah blah.
00:08:18:24 - 00:08:39:24
Unknown
But here's the rule. Every year I'm going to force you to lower your prices or what you get for, you know, spaghetti and meatballs, dish. Okay. Every year I'm going to force you to take less and your costs are going to go up. Your rents are going to go up. What you pay the staff is going to go up, Your insurance is going to go.
00:08:40:01 - 00:09:01:22
Unknown
Would you buy that restaurant if that was the deal? - Exactly, exactly. Not only that, but we're going to judge you on the quality of those meatballs and make you. and just the work. We're going to get extra work We're going to get. I didn't even get there. You beat me to that. So if you really And this is customer satisfaction.
00:09:01:24 - 00:09:20:04
Unknown
Yes. How quickly did you get that meatball out? We're going to put all this metrics on you? And by the way, this whole, you know, electronic medical records, which is going to like actually increase your work tenfold, but we're going to make you we're going to make you do that, too. So, yes, we get it all. But, you know, that's really what you're signing up for your signing-
00:09:20:04 - 00:09:54:15
Unknown
Who who, who gets into a business that by definition, the reimbursements for any particular work will go down year over year and they're gone. So anyway, so I think looking at it from the so, you know, people listen to this like, well, so how did how did medicine survive this? Well, they survived by doing some schtick. So back in 1980, you know, your typical primary care doctor, you know, I mean, I wasn’t obviously in clinical medicine, when I was a kid.
00:09:54:15 - 00:10:19:01
Unknown
But back in the 1980s, I mean, you know, a doctor would, you know, see 15 patients maybe a day. So so as the years roll by and he and his office manager knocks on the door and says, there is this it looks like, you know, our reimbursements are going to go down ten, 20% next year. Seems like, okay, instead of thing 15, I'll see 17 patients.
00:10:19:01 - 00:10:41:04
Unknown
They you know what I'll say in an extra hour however I do it. So they so we spent the last 20, 30 years doctors and health care were just trying to get more volume for the same amount of time. Okay. So now you can primary care doctors sees 30, 40 patients a day or hospitals see 30 or 40 patients a day.
00:10:41:06 - 00:11:02:06
Unknown
You know, I mean, that's really or and then a, shtick number one, shtick number two, let's start doing ultrasounds in the office. Let's start doing nerve conduction studies in office. Let's start selling, selling vitamins in the office and let's start doing Botox in the office. You know, these are all this is all a response to what's going on.
00:11:02:06 - 00:11:11:21
Unknown
And so I believe one of the things that that you talk about are five key ingredients to making a startup successful.
00:11:11:21 - 00:11:34:14
Unknown
And I think a lot of us would love to hear what that's all about. Like, what is your experience been and what can you share with us about that topic? Yeah, so I kind of discussed this also on my podcast and it's five main ones, but honestly there's probably 30 or 40 that lessons that you can learn at the beginning of of trying to run an organization.
00:11:34:14 - 00:11:56:17
Unknown
But I would say that you got to start with understanding that if you want to run an organization or start an organization, you need to acquire a certain amount of skill sets, right? Right. And I think one of the mistakes that people make is they think that they are they naturally have these skill sets because it was their idea.
00:11:56:17 - 00:12:14:23
Unknown
So they came up with this idea. So obviously they're the best person to run that organization or they're well, like or people like them. People are attracted to them or whatever, which are all needed to be a good leader and running an organization. But it's not going to be enough. You need to literally go out and get skill sets.
00:12:14:23 - 00:12:35:20
Unknown
As I always joke, you know, you wouldn't be able to land a 747 because you're a nice guy, right? You could you being a nice guy is not going to allow you to go in the cockpit and that you've got to get some skills right? Right. And I think people think that running an organization or being a CEO are all soft skills, that if you get along with people, you're a nice guy.
00:12:35:22 - 00:13:01:03
Unknown
People like you, people admire you or trust you that you can be a leader and that and by the way, you do need all those things, right? But on top of it, you need to acquire skill sets on how to be a leader, how to manage people, how to enroll people into your vision, how to motivate, how to, you know, put on, you know, press on the gas, pull off the gas.
00:13:01:05 - 00:13:13:09
Unknown
There's a whole host of strategies that if you're starting up and not just assumed since it was your idea that you naturally have that skill set and you need to go out and acquire those skill sets.
00:13:13:09 - 00:13:29:20
Unknown
It's very ICU in nature by you were just saying that you're like the CEO of multiple companies, so you're not afraid to just accept responsibility and take the load on yourself, which is very ICU nature of, you know, just I'll be willing to accept anything.
00:13:29:22 - 00:13:51:03
Unknown
Right. Well, the when you're in the ICU, the buck stops with you. There's like nobody there's nobody, like, behind you, right? So it is what it is. And yeah, you know, you're seeing, you know, 10, 15 patients a day in the ICU, you're like, okay, I go and everything. But yeah, I think that's a good point. I think I've gotten the question like, you regret, you know, the clinical part.
00:13:51:03 - 00:14:13:24
Unknown
You wish you had just done this from the beginning. And I think you hit the nail on the head. I don't think I would have had some of the soft skills and some of the insights without that clinical experience. So I don't I don't think I would, you know, be or have some of the skills that I have now without that clinical training, you know, So I'm grateful for it.
00:14:13:24 - 00:14:21:13
Unknown
And it really does make you so does make an impact that I think you hit the nail on the head, that you bring that with you
00:14:21:13 - 00:14:44:21
Unknown
Today we have a bullet proof system that helps us close up to 80% of those inbound calls. Our High Converting Call Class will teach you how to demonstrate your authority quickly without being pushy. We believe that many businesses out there can benefit from this, and we promise to help you achieve your revenue goals by converting more of your incoming calls into actual sales.
00:14:44:23 - 00:14:55:01
Unknown
For more information, please visit our website at HighConvertingCallClass.com. Stop waiting for the sales to come to you. Put your revenue into your hands.
00:14:55:01 - 00:14:58:12
Unknown
How about on the physician side? What's special about like a physician entrepreneur?
00:14:58:12 - 00:15:29:24
Unknown
What do they need to be mindful of that a regular person maybe doesn't need to be so concerned with? I think two things. I think for a lot of physicians and myself included, we think and some level what we're doing is a calling from God or, you know, some higher level thing, which is true. And so I think when you then kind of say, Hey, how would you like to also focus on this thing on a capitalistic side or whatever, kind of like it's like for some people it just doesn't sit well.
00:15:29:24 - 00:15:53:09
Unknown
So I get that and I think but you have to understand that theoretically you could help you could help people by seeing patients or you could help people by doing something in the health care field that improves the lives of people, maybe exponentially. So if you view it like they're both valid channels, I think it's easier to, you know, if you're leaning in that direction to think about.
00:15:53:11 - 00:16:15:19
Unknown
But I think the second problem with physicians is, you know, they spend, you know, 10, 15 years training for what they're doing and then they work 60, 70, 80 hours a week. So people always think doctors are bad entrepreneurs. They are, but not for the reason you think they're bad entrepreneurs because they're doing something else 80 hours a week.
00:16:15:23 - 00:16:38:10
Unknown
Yeah. And you know, I'd be a bad anything if I was working 80 hours a week. And then you tell me, by the way, take up gardening, you know, I'm probably going to be a bad gardener. So. So I think part of it is I don't it doctors get a bad rap the like. they're all you know, you know, they're bad investors, they're bad entrepreneurs, they're bad.
00:16:38:12 - 00:16:58:19
Unknown
But but because they're so committed often to their know main thing that anything they do is is like a side gig. And so one of the advice I give really, if you're really going to break out of that clinical mode, you yes, there may be a period where you may have to work 60/80 hours while the side thing gets going.
00:16:58:19 - 00:17:16:21
Unknown
But at a certain point, you're going to have to devote time and energy because, look, they got into med school, they passed organic chemistry, physics, just you know, they passed the MCAT’s and did well. They got into med school. They passed all the boards. They're not idiots. They just need to focus. And there you go.
00:17:16:21 - 00:17:49:10
Unknown
So moving on to the second question, and the second question that I have for you is what do you think the goals of digital health care should be helping both the patients as well as the provider? Yeah, I think the goal obviously is to reduce friction because I think, you know, we've all had you know, we've all tried to like go shopping online and certain website is more cumbersome and difficult and you know, we tend to skip those and that people kind of give up and what have you.
00:17:49:15 - 00:18:20:00
Unknown
The more friction there is a system, the less likely people are to use it. It doesn't mean people won't use it, but it will just make it less likely. So I think the reducing friction and reducing roadblocks where things are easy and I think, you know, that's one of the popularites of Amazon, for example, is the fact that they can, you know, so people can so easily buy something without, you know, inputting their information every time and what have you.
00:18:20:00 - 00:18:46:23
Unknown
And I think that sort of technology where it's the least amount of work to get what you need to get an appointment, to get a result, to communicate, to get a prescription, what have you. And then from the provider side, yeah, so I just saw a study and I did a podcast on this on my YouTube channel about, you know, the amount of time a doctor spends in front of a computer and during a normal visit.
00:18:47:00 - 00:19:27:09
Unknown
And so it is 60, 70, 80% of the time as opposed to talking to the patient. So obviously, yes, okay. We gave this doctor a provider, this great technology, but it really is undermining the goal of that technology would be for the doctor to or a provider to spend more face time, not less face time. So I think I think many of my colleagues would attest that digital technology has actually reduce their face time with because when you were just scribbling on a piece of paper, you could just make a couple of abbreviations, a couple of lines, blah, blah, blah, which I don't agree.
00:19:27:09 - 00:19:45:02
Unknown
It was good. But now the flip side is you're you're given this, you know, Herculean task of filling out this form during the encounter. So I think we need to make life for the provider easier, too, and reduce friction there so they can spend more time with the patient.
00:19:45:02 - 00:20:13:00
Unknown
You know, medicine on some level is so fragmented, You without technology, right? You go see one doctor, repeat the same tests that your last doctor go to the hospital. They don't know what your doctor did. So obviously, the fragmentation is like begging for technology, right. But the problem really is, you know, how technology is deployed becomes the issue.
00:20:13:02 - 00:20:43:17
Unknown
Because, look, if Amazon can figure it out. Right. And they're not like such a huge percentage GDP, like health care is right. But they have access to like anything like on your phone, you know, you could order, you know, a new sweater and I'll be there the next day. That's not how health care works right now. I mean, I'm still surprised how many people walk into a doctor's office and they're given a clipboard.
00:20:43:19 - 00:21:04:14
Unknown
Right. But that's like that's screams to anybody, like. Or if you try to call your doctor's offices and they say, press one for this, press two for them. Really? That's that's really what it is. So obviously, we have room. The problem is I think we have room to grow. But we need a lot of room to grow.
00:21:04:14 - 00:21:53:18
Unknown
Could you help me understand a little bit about what your process is, how your mind works? Please, in terms of our business side or entrepreneurship side, I think we are. Our strategy is try to come out and provide products and services that don't just move the needle a little bit, but actually make a dramatic impact. And leverage technology as much as you can so you have a real likelihood of success because the more you can leverage technology to impact people's lives, especially in health care, the the the results are exponential, how many people you can impact.
00:21:53:20 - 00:22:24:06
Unknown
So it's not simply I put in this kind of work and in clinical medicine, you see one patient at a time, which is good. But if you want to maybe impact thousands or hundreds of thousands of people, there are opportunities out there if you're willing to try to solve these problems, leverage technology and think how how your your system can have the most dramatic impact on the most people.